Video 5

Panchadasi - Lecture 5

my own leaders from the unreal to the real Vegas some darkness and tonight Vegas from death and to immortality Oh [Music] this Vedic prayer leaders from under unreal to the real what you're praying there in terms of the example that we set leaders from that forest in the lake to the lake itself to see leaders from darkness into light darkness of ignorance because of which we think we are this body mind until light that is pure consciousness leaders from dead to immortality as long as you are as as long as you think that you are d you're on this side of the screen that I am this body I am the subtle body this gross body then I'm in the realm of death why because it changes a baby grows into a child a child into an eternal sin and say what's wrong it's nice yes but what happens after that a young person who grows into a middle-aged person a middle-aged person into a senior person and no matter how much he over you do how much gluten through you take it deteriorates in breaks down body begins to break break it down into aches and pains and problems and finally dies so as long as you're on this side cross body subtle body you are in trouble that's the realm of death change and death continuously changing it's a realm of death written with two means death even the causal body because the causal body is seen because our body is what we experience in deep sleep in deep sleep there seems to be no problem you know you're not aware of anything it's blank in fact it seems to be rather nice because it's very but it has the seed of the waking and the dreaming in it the deep sleep will always break up break out into a dream or awaking where samsara is there so both the seed and the sprout are not good neither because that state is good now the subtle Nadi physical but what a point of Atlanta says these are all appearances and the reality is right there if the snake is appearing when is the rope the reality the rope where is it if somebody tells you it's not a snake you're making a mistake the classic example of the snake and the rope it's not a snake you're making a mistake it's a rope then we'll meet in a row where where is the rope the real rope you seen a snake there somebody tells you it's not a snake you're making a mistake it's a row the Rope is real the snake is an error a mistake now if I ask where is the rope where they're teaching it is there itself there itself you are mistaking the Rope for a snake if that's what's happening in the same way if this is samsara and this is false the reality is Brandon where is Brahman here right here when is Brandon right now yes not as a slogan right here right now actually here and now actually here are not in fact the here-and-now feeling that we get is because of Brandon the Isthmus the awareness that negative is because of problem so it's it's not arranged some heavens in some other space it's not separated from us by space it's not away and time after death no it's now and it's here Brahman that's what a great of Atlantis is now that know better when our needs are in our story okay now let me complete the thought I was talking about the prayer from the Unreal leaders to the real from this some sad appearance leaders to Brennan from the snake appearance leaders to the reality the RO what it means here is from this appearance of samsara show us lead us to the real that's brown from darkness ignorant we are on this side of ignorance remember Raman covered up by Olivia ignorance leads to our individual existence so we are on this side of ignorance we all want to cross over from darkness to light and that crossing over can happen only by knowledge from death to immortality as long as we are on this side of ignorance we are attached or they are identified with a body which is going to die and no matter how much we have to be read and now much philosophy it still is going to feel I am dying it's because we it's not real for us yet it's just some theoretical stuff but it can be real it can make a huge difference I will not go into the particulars but a couple of months back this lady wrote to me that she wanted to speak with me and many people right so I generally I don't entertain respect there is no time to speak to individual people it has to be through a class or something so I sort of put it up and I said all right when there is occasion later on maybe some day when she wrote and said that I am dying yes so I do not go into the particulars and then of course I said of course we must speak there and or Skype and she was passing away she was in the terminal stages of cancer but so much dignity and light and grace because of pursuing a spiritual life she was interested in Vedanta and ramakrishna in buddhism and she had pursued different packs and investigated it all her life and she's very serious about it never once did I hear a complaint or grumble of how horrible it isn't that I am sake and I know she's always calm and dignified full of light and grace and I told her once that maybe you reached out for help but you helped me you showed me that that what this knowledge can do cultivation of spirituality serious pursuit of spirituality what it can do for you and then she did massive a few days up to that it does him if you come into it it does him I mean you forget about being fully enlightened or whatever but if you take it seriously put your mind to it and stay with it for some time it will give you enormous benefits it gives you more benefits than anything else in the universe so our movement is from the Unreal to the real from darkness and to light from death to immortality this is what we are seeking now Advaita Vedanta tells us that you are this Brahmin all you need to do to realize this how do you realize it in Vedanta I have to go to a teacher and learn this and we we saw the position we'll be wearing our story if that the student has come to the teacher and wants to know what the reality is and the teacher is going to teach the student what the teacher is going to see that's what we are going to read I am again going to summarize the teaching here but before we go into that there are different ways in Vedanta the method is in fire why is the method in quiet it's worth thinking about before we go into it why is it in quietly why is it not prayer why is it not doing good words why is it not even meditation why is it inquiring which are alive Sanskrit this seems like a pretty intellectual thing to do what does it got to do with with spirituality in fact this is the highest form of spirituality that we know of in Veda and in in Hinduism final form if this does not work then they will recommended because the Samadhi tree that's power lower that is not where they will recommend some other practices to you and so on but if this works nothing else is needed so which are not and we'll come to that but let's look at the other stages and the other practices the other practices are the yoga practices the productive practices Raja yoga bhakti yoga Karma Yoga what do those things Raja yoga which is meditation basically potentially use bhakti-yoga and Kathy karmayoga it purifies the life in fact it efficiently now listen I'm giving you the traditional approach in Advaita Vedanta you will say why does banana have to be which other have to get the top what does it get to be at the top because we are following the pattern of knowledge so they will always privileged knowledge above everything else now family yoga purifies the mind other practices rather yoga country yoga doing of good works Lorelai devotion to God meditation those are not dispensed with those are bangle but we must put them into place and what do they do for us so karma yoga purifies the mind in Sanskrit cheap passivity we put at the bottom but and we think it's a non glamorous thing it's a preliminary thing for for beginners not for me for me is non dual Vedanta am difficult for some architects for me a veritable totapuri and ramana maharshi combination I am Swami I show calendar yes that's also true we can convert this teaching on say to Karma Yoga Swami Yogananda he writes in a letter to one of his disciples in fact lecture or a talk ashoka energy who was in San Francisco he says that when I tell you to do karma yoga I know what you are thinking you're thinking of a Swami doesn't think unfit for meditation well I'll show him and are shocked and he says and you do show me but not in the way you thought you would so karma yoga is a basis purification of the mind with that purified mind may be practice many the ocean he concentrates away these two are very much essential but without a concentrated mic are really concentrated mine on a shaky mind a concentrated mind it will hold on to the spiritual truth and a purified mind without a purified mind you cannot concentrated what teacher said also called attempts at meditation the products of meditation you feel calm and concentrated that's artificial that's false it will not last unless the mind is act at its base purified what do you mean by purified mind what do you mean my name your mind if your mind lot of desires and vasanas a hundred and one goes to in in life this and that and the other tendencies or all the garbage that we have poured in the mind at least in this life other life let's forget it what we have tried was this life is all the conditioning that we have done for the month that's the impurity and that has to be cleansed one powerful way one very powerful ways Karma Yoga is an unselfish of doing of our daily duties and acts as a worship of God if you do not believe in God's at least unselfishly doing the duty to work for the sake of the work I have nothing to gain for it you see the usual way we work is by working for ourselves just about everything that we do for me and for mine and this puts on a chain of unselfishness one more link in the chain of selfishness because it focuses us it tears us down to this body mind and it's exactly what we are trying to cut the time to this body mind more selfish action that we do I am earning money I am eating food and doing all my actions all my comfort everything in life for what for this bundle of flesh if I do that then day and night and strengthening my bond to this little identity whatever little philosophy you do once in a year rating lumen they will will not even scratch the surface because of conditioning my life throughout I am this body whereas currently Yoga were done for the welfare of others without concern for oneself it purifies the mind it removes that stain of self-seeking now now purified - concentrated work through meditation but these are powerfully again in the path of knowledge these are powerfully Mukti means love up top love of God is a powerful game nothing concentrates the mind so much is love of mine so you have a pure concentrated mind now we approach the path of knowledge Gyan yoga what did it do it removes ignorance how does it remove ignorance by producing knowledge generating knowledge knowledge of what the knowledge of I am Brahman and acknowledge how you generate not how do you return it any knowledge save money by see we're trying to learn so knowledge of the nature and remember one key thing here we are not actually trying to realize that I am from them what we have you see most of these techniques these techniques are usually what I am NOT all these techniques will see now these techniques are almost always what I am NOT what our real problem is we have identified ourselves we have tied ourselves to what we are not I am NOT not a body but I think that the body and not the changing mind I think I'll change my fate it this is our problem and we I must be shown that I am NOT the body I must be shown that I'm not the mind let the body be there let the mind be there but I am NOT it I'm not limited to it that's what I need there is no switch without the speaking about the real consciousness how do I go here is a technique not to write down to see yes now there was a countdown in the notes and close enough that's it to see right now as possible right behind you there is this beautiful lake which is deep blue income it is a very very bright blue because the sky the blue sky is being reflected there so take a look yeah you can see that right it's very nice and you alright here is the technique now the technique is is like these are techniques based on some Kashmiri shaver practices not an employer without the practice but it works whether the practice goes like this you go to the is it coming back yes [Music] the practices like this the lake is is compared it connected to the mind that link there that body of water there is like the mind okay and the blue sky affected in the lake is like the consciousness that you feel in the mind just now okay so far so good now imagine first imagine that you're sitting on the side of the lake on the bank of the lake and looking into the wide expanse of water you're looking at that and now look into the water and see the blue sky reflected in the water the blue sky reflected in the water you seeing the blue sky reflected in the water naturally the tendency comes let me see the original and we slowly lift open your eyes there if you look at the blue sky reflected in the water and slowly look up into the bright blue sky above okay so far now what you do is apply this look into the mind sitting relaxed mind is like that Lake wide expanse of the lake the wide expanse of the mind thoughts feelings emotions ideas memories note that all these thoughts feelings emotions ideas memories your array neurotic this Islamic note heart is coming right now all right you are aware of no doubt that's also true you are aware of the thoughts and feelings and desires memories or their absence note that awareness in in the mind like the blue sky in the lake now just as you lifted your eyes from the lake to look up at the original sky this mind and the awareness in the mind which you are which you note right now what notes it to what does it have appear like lifting your eyes from the lake and the reflected sky in the lake to the original sky step back turn around relax back from the mind and the reflected awareness in the mind to the one who notices all this if your attention wanders away don't worry note that your attention is wandered away whatever you're thinking of or listening to or feeling that's the mind note that there is awareness what is aware of the mind and the awareness right now step back turn around relax back when you're comfortable you can slowly open your eyes that's just a technique it's called Prakriti technique to enable you to go from the small sea to the big sea some of you I can see it seems to make sense to some it might not make sense if you think about it intellectualizing it will not make sense it's more of a technique a way to trick you out of your mind very simple technique subject one is a window like that no you are you're staring into the blue sky through a window like that and so there is space absolutely nothing here blue sky here but you're aware of the window the frame now stare intensely at the space framed by the window intensely so that all thoughts are blanked out into that space blue space framed by the window after a few seconds drop the window the frame is remove the frame from your imagination what will happen just space it's basically your awareness framed by an object to the window when you drop the object that awareness tends to become unlimited again these are all from Kashmir Shaiva tradition now coming back to our student who has been whirling at all around in the cycle of births and deaths and finally in this particular birth has come to the teacher and the now the teacher out of compassion teaches the student so metal ha ha which are romantic environment with optical quality there are different processes and you those who are veterans will be nothing the world about me processes again anything remember all this is taken for granted that to some extent of lines of purified to some extent our minds are concentrated and it's Rami no our that's a big problem for me to some extent we all have these qualifications otherwise you wouldn't be here why would you spend a nice long weekend listening to some abstruse philosophy you could be out camping and having a nice time such a beautiful place why listen to long and boring lectures on and philosophy already there is there is this purification of the mind because we are already seeking that seeking cannot come without an initial purification of the mind without a spiritual maturity so already we had some of that but it needs to be intensified all right now that which are our techniques there are different techniques in Vedanta these are techniques of which are these are not now what the teacher is going to teach is not techniques of meditation is not going to teach the student how to sit straight or how to breathe or how to do over ship no no no I'm not going to teach them they're going to teach the Highness staging to know that you are random how all these techniques which will be shown are basically pointing out to a reality which is there available to us but we don't see it so that's going to be pointed out what are the common techniques we come across in bechara in the operations one was what we did last time then there is what is called I was popular with each other I was fantastically then there is punished accordingly these are the main ones this is the method of the sphere and the scene this is the method of three States breaking breathing and deep sleep this is the method of five sheets these are three main words and last last time you achieve this what we do and these are meant for enlightenment after this is star if the students is yeah I got it I wrote it down and I understand what you're saying saying but I'm not enlightened yet then the teacher would say hmm I see the problem here is a mantra go and repeat it come back after 15 years morning and evening what is the problem the problem is that teaching should lead to enlightenment if it doesn't if it still seems like something theoretical something in a book I remember this young monk who came to our ministry and we were teaching the usual stuff including all this stuff with alpha beta with our new teaching that in a class and all sorts of things were being taught for the for the novices and one day one month was teaching them the dynamic was teaching them pooja the traditional worship and a part of the pooja is a little bit of proud I am of controlling the product in the part of that we do this breathing to account of maybe 400 times over it it to a count of 16 and then let it go to a count of eight then again breathe in to a count of four and so on so that's a pranayama control of the breath it's a part of the puja before its initial preparation when that was shown this young novice he meant wow this is what I was looking for now we had already gone through Madonna and and you know quickly share a very kind and the difference between the body and the mind and pure consciousness and he was yeah this is interesting so that's where our level is if show me something to do something clear and then I thought okay I'm spiritual it's alright to listen to a lecture on pathology that's fine interesting if you can show me how to do a headstand man that's really something but that just shows my state so the teachers at that in those days would say okay you do that next like come back we'll meet here the teacher who's teaching the student we see that he takes a mono method that is the last one it could be any of them just for an example here it when this last one is taken up bunch of OSHA so what is it plungeco Chevy Vega this method is based on the type theory operation one of the hope initiatives at 80 of your finish at second chapter when all the details some people what is this method this method proceeds on the principle that if you want to teach something very subtle you should start with the obvious you should start with the gross and then go to the subtle you should start with what is known and then go to the unknown golden rule of teaching step by step so let's see what it does it it starts with I want to show you that you are running on pure consciousness that's difficult so let me start with what you think is obvious what do you think you are and I say here the student says here I have this or this body is what you think you want yes all right let's see so the body is called in English [Applause] she the world she is portion under nice movie Maya means an effect a transformation of food why is it called that is because this body would be eat what we had for lunch and dinner results are always of it is being it's being assimilated into the body so the body is basically a modification of what we eat and drink that's why it's called the hunger where do you think you are the body and the student says yeah I feel that but didn't notice something all right I did not go into this the usual way a bunch of push every wake up if there's a particular technique for that and that bit journey does in the third chapter but in this chapter he takes a novel way out so let me just point out the five sheets and then I will just follow the way this chapter us he has taken in this chapter it's a new way of doing the punch of kosher we wake up which is normally not done so what he does in this if we look within we find the life processes reading a simulation of food that which transforms food into flesh and the red book the circulation of blood all the life process is going on in the body that's our proud life and it's English translation would be vital she as we look deeper then we find beyond be subtler than inner to be prime a subtler than that we find the mind such memories feelings the mind that's not even home at the mention she our mind as we look deeper than that it's actually the mind but a modification of the mind a part of the mind which is they intellect it's the same thing but when you are just thinking when you are between two options that's the mind which is swinging from one alternative to another but when you say that you know I know my name is Swami sarahfey Ananda I know that I have this body it's wrong knowledge but I feel I know I know two plus two is four that I know that faculty that's the intellect the you know the feeling we get as kids when we were working through a mathematics problem and we suddenly feel that I can write now that flash of understanding that's angel X that's our directly animal Vidya is intellect in English the intellection and beyond that beyond the intellect understanding which you are using right now what's the intellect nothing theoretical you're using it right beyond that beyond my body on many subtler than that inner to that is what it's got ours and when we got our attention on me it is not true there but it's there bliss bliss is my canvas number it's what we experience in deep sleep when the intellect shuts shuts down we are not aware of the mind functioning of the ground function or the existence of the body sleeping on the bed with all of this blanket if it's like you're not aware of any of this indeed sleep that blindness that restfulness that's this and this is what we know about ourselves none of this is when either by the way it's just pointing out labeling what we know about ourselves we don't notice it we're not just pointing it up to it look here we have a body and it subtler than the body inner to the body you have life forces and in her to that you have the mind subtler than that and in her to the mind and subtler than the mind is the intellect which is also the mind but itself very fine part of the mind and inner to that subtler than that then everything is blanketed out in deep sleep that blackness that restfulness that quietness there that's called the onion lemon just that thing itself is counting on the man all of this is not unknown to us this is what we experience and this is the range of what we experience what are you is the question what are you are you the body or the other life forces or the mind or the intellect or the blindness beyond everything strange as that might sound or a combination of all of these things what are you and usual way of doing sakura-chan did you find it a teary opposition and in the third chapter of this book there's usually where what he for the teacher does is shows you that you cannot be the body why can you not be the body because it shows you that you when the hill from there the body has changed so much from a baby to a child to a teenager to a middle-aged person a senior person it changes so much if you feel I got that kid I was a teenager I was that young person I am the senior person I am the same person and yet the body is changed enormously how can you be both changing and changeless so if you feel that you are not changing at the body's changing you cannot be the body what is it another reason what we saw earlier isn't the body and object of your awareness body is an object you are the experience of what is experience you are - stuffs here the body is seen this ship make speed thing they see is the scene the subjective object cannot be the same thing Thanks you're not the one who still needs an object of experience another second reason third reason is you are awareness all the time when we talk about the officers we talk about yourself as sentient awareness consciousness and the body is an object not aware not sentient not conscious we can talk about that it's and here's to be conscious because it borrows consciousness from you but in general it's not conscious I mean simple experiment which I talked about as investor base is that if you look at any part of the body here and looking at my hand notice the quality of this experience when I look at my hand notice the quality of this experience I feel I am aware of that I don't think that any is aware of me that will be scary like some horror movie hello no I am a leader of the hand I don't see that there's no such experience at the hand is aware of me so my experience is that I am aware awareness in our inner day the texture of our experience if you go if you notice it carefully mmm this seems to be on my side not on the side of the hand and the hand is just one part of the body the other part is also the same legs and belly and head and chest and everything I dissolve arts none of them seem to be aware of me I seem to be aware of them so though individual part of the body seems to be aware so the colligative thing is not aware the whole body is not aware of me and yet I am aware of the body I am awareness the body is in sentient I am sentient bodies in change in seneschal how can I be the body so such reasons are given to show that you are not the body not just argue argue you have to understand these reasons understand the arguments but go one step further use them as fighters to see that you're not the body if you are holding on to the fact that I have a body no amount of playing the lawyer to say that what you are watching for you your honor you're not a bunny the accused a sees the body but is not the body no amount of arguing will prove to the person who's convinced an antibody you may give very nice and too much but I still feel adequate so you are supposed to see that you love the body and inside and then you move from here to be vital sheep and similar arguments are given that the writer Jean is changing your unchanging it's an object it is an object of awareness for such reason to another item she knew not the mind chief you're not that intelligent and like this big movement is like this that's the normal way of using this usual the accustomed way of using this method of pie sheets but what the teacher does here is quite interesting she points it out to the student you know all this all of this now he says here this one is for Z gross body do you remember we learned about across one and this one here is called Lisa and this one here is called the causal body remember we got ignorance because this body in the body now doesn't matter is there any ghosts you see so here you have five sheets on what of yourself the human personality and three bodies basically it's the same thing but we are classified in different ways if you see it as the Poochie like a cheap mighty intellect she did blitz she then there are business you are looking at this whole structure has five sheets if you look at it as gross body inside lying and mind and intellect subtle body beyond that the blankness causal body then you're looking at this three parts now what the teacher says is all this - see that you have physical body yes your son's body yes and a causal got in the on time yes which one are you of these three which one are you are you all of them together or any one of them are you none of them is going to show and what is the method that he uses the method he uses is in this book the new method not the method which is traditional use new method uses is called diabetic the method of agreement difference the method of agreement and difference method ah our method of presence and absence method of presence and absence we've already seen this in the morning I demonstrate what how the teacher teaches what the teacher says is the problem essence of the problem is this what am i of these three bodies what am i if M is same as the physical body or am i different from the physical body remember this example dependent needs cap are dependent the cap the same thing or are they different entities we seem to be together what are the different entities are the car and the driver the same one entity or are they different entities they usually seem to be together but we know they are different why I can show you the driver apart from the car and I can show you the car apart from the driver I can show you the pen apart from the cap and I can show you the cap apart from the pen this is basically the method of presence and absence agreement and difference so this method is used by the teacher the teacher says o student attend to this do you think you are the physical body you are the same as the physical body yeah why not well consider your dream experiences did you dream when you were dreaming you went to sleep on the bed and then you forgot all of that and you were dreaming you were somewhere else and with other people and things were not happening that's what dream experience did you have a dream experience and student says yes so in you dream value there of course I was dead I mean as a self as an experience of the dream and the body sleeping on the bed it was in any part of your dream no that means the dream experience shows you our present bodies I and is equal one plus pi in three when you dream aren't you there otherwise you'd rent whatever you are whatever you are into dream a mind or psychic presence or whatever but you are there because it's your dream after all so you dream are you they are not yes yes and in your dream is the gross body a part of the dream now don't say here obviously the body is there is eating on the bed I'm not aware of it that's the point from your perspective from your experience do you have any existence any proof of your existence with our awareness of the body answer is yes that's the dream state where I I have a first-person experience of my own existence and without any reference to the physical body and just totally lost touch with the physical body in my experience somebody is seeing it from outside we'll say here you are sleeping on the bed I saw your body but then you didn't see me and now not making sense in the waking state offices in the waking State what happens is our and the body I and the body are present together right now consider this why is it so difficult to separate yourself from the body here to see yourself as separate from the body because you are it's in your experience right now bodies presented you are also present now I am showing you an experience which you have which they all have when you were present when the body was compressors stay with this is it difficult it is quiet because of two reasons it's fairly obvious get along with it I don't know what he's saying now it must you must walk with me yes me you must follow me otherwise I think I'm doing great at the end of it everybody looks mystified what did you see if we as kids miss to read these Tintin comics so in the stint in comics there's one one of them is explorers on the moon or something like that never so there is this professor calculus and this is Captain Haddock was fond of cursing and everything and so professor calculus is walking and explaining how the nuclear fission reaction takes place no Neutron goes into the it of the nucleus and it splits the nucleus and releases some amount of energy and some other particles and so on they're walking and you can see Captain Haddock is right behind the professor and he doesn't understand any of it it's so mystifying in his fierce scowl on his face and one of mine the professor starts and looks back are you following me and the captain with the fierce calluses yes of course we are right behind not another day we must walk together it's a lady's simple point I'm showing you an experience which you cannot deny your dreams when you experience so many things but not your physical body which means the conclusion being like this I am sure if you want without the other from this one without the other I'm showing you you without the body hence what does it mean I'm showing you the cat without the pen it means captain pain are not connected and they are not one entity you and the body and not wanted entity though in the waking state you seem to function completely integrated with the body but you and the body are not one entity by this kind of thinking so you are not the body at one stroke the teacher shows am I the mind this one the second point the white and sheet mind she intellect she am i this one vedanta says no the mind sheet is difficult because the subtle body is different and you are different how can you show that now the state of deep sleep is a best thinking about thinking about don't go into deep sleep in cities think about deep sleep in your waking state use the mind to think about to use the intellect to think about it what happens in deep sleep the gross body are clearly not evident in deep sleep clearly not evident in deep sleep you're not aware of the body in deep sleep you're not aware of the mind in deep sleep the intellect or the prana of the breathing and life force is going on its body you're not aware of any of that in deep sleep and yet are you there you might say no I'm not there if you're not there who or what experienced the deep sleep you say who if you if you protest you say who experience it if nobody experienced the deep sleep if nobody experienced the deep sleep you wouldn't claim to have a had a deep sleep when you wake up when you say I was arranged I went into sleep and I dreamt I agreed that I'd rent and then there was a period of dreamless sleep I slept like a log we have this expression similar expressions in all countries of the world in all languages the experience of treatment deep sleep is undeniable everybody experiences a period of complete rest and blindness yet that is also an experience and experience of absence is not absence of experience deep sleep is an experience of absence it's still an experience and experience requires consciousness you were there otherwise if you had no experience of deep sleep if there was no experience so that some kind of experience was not there then what would happen is you would say I wasn't really I fell asleep I dream it I'm available but you don't see that say I fell asleep I dreamt up there were periods of nothing just like and now I'm awake yet nothing just blank piece slept like a lot didn't know anything that is deep sleep yeah so shows here is a state which we all experience without experience of physical body without experience of mind and intellect and prana yet I am there I am there remember not as you don't say there you don't feel it you don't think it if you say it feel it think it then the mind is there right because the mind is not there we cannot say our thinking them that I am I am a deep sleep if you think I am in deep sleep we are not in deep sleep so deep sleep when you think back upon deep sleep from this position it shows that you cannot be a subtle body us because the subtle body was not present in deep sleep yet you claim to have a deep sleep experience so you can exist without the subtle body so you are not the body you are not the mind what about the causal body the last one because supposed to be an experience because here the teacher says in Samadhi I am present I are the ego is consciousness the causal bodies interest a big dia in Samadhi that is also God so in that is God I am present alone only as consciousness as consciousness without an object that's that's in Samadhi so I realize myself as witness consciousness apart from the physical body apart from the subtle body apart from the causal body what happens same babies in the waiting stages physical part is present and I am also here so it's very natural to think I have this one but when we consider the dream I realized I can exist I can dream without any reference to the physical body physical body maybe on my bed and sleeping somewhere and I might be doing whitewater rafting and on a river that's my experience where is the physical body sleeping on the bed knowing me and hit unexist now the everything is okay now in the deep sleep stage I experienced an existence without thinking anything without any charge memories personal identity individuality all of it is erased but an existence of darkness and blackness and the thickness that experience shows I can be something without a cross body an essential body without the body of mine and the experience of Samadhi shows I can be without the darkness of deep sleepers without the dark without the mind of without the physical body also so my limited of agreement and disagreement presents an absence he has shown like this this and this separately here show now if we considered our experience our day-to-day experience we will see this mystical look at that and pointing it up to you you cannot be the body though you work through the body you cannot be the mind though you use the mind and intellect you cannot be the blankness of deep sleep do you experience that also you are something apart from the causal body subtle body gross body this pointing out yes being away I have nothing else deep-sea that's it yes that's the same thing yeah this other way of saying it this is just a method of presence and absence it's similar to pointing out here yeah yes not also it might be possible there is a school of thought which says that there is no experience in deep sleep it's not an experience of absence it's just no experience at all it's not a bit not excluded sandy is pool for example they say that and they say then how do you explain that we feel I had deep sleep I slept nicely I have complete rest I did not experience any trouble or I did not experience anything that thing how do you explain that that feeling which is common to everybody we've all experienced it so then the jnanis will say when I asked would they say we infer it we infer it and that might seem reasonable until you take a closer look and it does not seem reasonable why do we actually do this I went to sleep at 10:00 p.m. last night then I had a series of dreams in all those dreams couldn't have lasted more than two or three hours maybe two hours and I woke up at 6 a.m. today that's eight hours to the remaining six hours for four hours must have been deep sleep do we ever do that never without even looking in the clock get up early in the morning and slowly our aching awareness comes up we come up into the waking world we feel the tendrils of dreams floating away slowly forgetting dreams and we also feel there were gaps they were complete deep rest sometimes you get that without any inference at all well data is you clean closely to your experience your experience is supplying you with all you need for enlightenment I feel good therefore I had deep sleep or that feeling of emerging from a complete blank state that would it be an entrance or would it be an experience it's an experience look at that look you look back upon the texture of it all right let's take it completely as something very new a very modern approach to it completely materialistic neuroscience approach to it I saw recent a recent article by the same even Thompson on deep sleep and he says based on the fMRI studies of the brains in deep sleep study of the brain waves brain and the reading through the scans of the brains in deep sleep we are not justified in saying that there is no consciousness in the you sleep the brain is quite busy in deep sleep quite specific quite busy in deep sleep the brain is quite busy in deep sleep different patterns for dreams different patterns of activity for making but definitely busy neurons are firing things are happening in the brain so purely on an objective basis from a distance if I look at the data the data shows me what is happening during consciousness where you where you report consciousness you're the are you conscious yes what I see in your brain is more or less similar to what I see when you when you are in deep sleep then my point is a very materialistic point of view they would say that there there's something in deep sleep why we have a problem with this is our general and understanding of consciousness is a waking consciousness or at most a dream consciousness where there is a subject and an object and we have thoughts and feelings and perceptions that's what we call consciousness you take away all the objects we feel nothing but nothing here are they wrong right for example I'll show you something air space but the most irritated if I tell you it's full of lights it's shiny it's it's it's it's overflowing with light and radiance here show me yes if I do it here and wait here Chloe [Music] dear I'm appending to the Sun here right here here is the sparkler no like you see in life aha here is the thing it needs an object lines needs life there it's full of life it needs an object to express itself now see what they done to the monastic language the light illumines the object the paper market shines in the left but what does the napkin do for the left the business trip word because it said a beam get thee it manifests the life life is present here but not manifest to us it's magnetized opinion reflector comes along what does the line do for the paper nothing in humans what does the paper napkin do for the life in many physics and already existing life become a another life oh yes but do you see that involves the most of life here I did this once in a presentation in the London University I gave a talk there and I want you to prove that there is consciousness and deep sleep the same question and then this for my presentation these are projected [Applause] in the same way what happens according to what happens deep sleep is there are no thoughts no emotions no percepts nothing to shine in so the objects are not your body the world no mind no time space no experience of time in space in deep sleep yes in fact that's what we are the same it is a homogeneous mass of ignorance deep sleep is according to Vedanta deep sleep is not enlightenment is not enlightenment I give another example example you know in the earlier days when we killed this movie vaults let go and see a movie a film and when the film is on its like this the film is on you are seeing the picture the film and one time these two have these intervals I don't eat their intervals and movies anymore this time intervals in the movies haunts in India and you you can go out and the cover or something like that so the switcher of the movie for a while 15 minutes or 20 minutes and then you can come back in again now when there is an interval the movie is switched off and what happens is this darkness in the hall you don't see the movie but you don't see anything else also and then the lights of the hall come on where you actually see the hall and the screen and everything when you're seeing the movie it's waking state or dream state when everything is switched on for the interval darkness that's deep sleep when the actual lights come on and you see the hall as it is that's entitled and then what what movie mr. but don't extend it too far because in enlightenment two people know and I two people see the same world but they know it when you are enlightened about the forest in the lake you still see it the forest in the lake but you know it's a distally is no forest in there so it will not apply exactly like that yes yes No the ego is here it's very easy to see why don't you see it in your own mind just say I did you feel i when you feel the I then I is clearly in the mind it's not in the body but it's not there but not here not just this also because when you feel I there is something which is illumining or watching desire the real eye is not the ego the ego is in the subtle body what we are talking about this right now we are trying to discuss we're trying to find out who are what what are you so in the waking State I was present in the body and the mic but in the dream state I am present without the party so I cannot be the body I'm there - bottle cap without the in there is some part and I'm not the question of the mind and this eye is pure consciousness the witness but it is also here it's also here it's also here the Samadhi separates or does it actually separate or it just shows the separation right when the driver is in the car when you see the car with the driver as the driver been permanently attached to the car no but to understand the difference between the driver and the car you must ask the driver to step out you can appreciate the driver apart from the car even when the dragon is inside the ground and driving it is still separate so even when you are in the body gross body and subtle body and causal body there and driving this vehicle you're still separate right the deep sleep is regarded as a seed state all your waking and dreaming is there in deep sleep I will notice something you are making in mind making a different why because your body is different my body is different your personal histories different you're a different person I'm a different person so our experience is a different right now for example you have seen you from that perspective and seeing you are from this perspective our experiences are different so everybody's waking experience is different our dreams are also different you dream of something I do have something else dreams are also different but have you noticed our all our deep sleep experiences are exactly the same experiences are different from each other and a sense of XP the experience of absence is the same for everybody who's absent in absence there cannot be any distinguishing feature so variety in sleepwalking which is not common but maybe we are all sleepwalking in a certain way but well who's missing in sleepwalking what is missing forgive that because keep walking who sees know who sees sleepwalking you don't see it see the reason why I am NOT will going there is that's again you're looking at it objectively from outside but I am asking whatever the person inside if the person is sleepwalking sleep then person is asleep sleeps or that person doesn't experience the sleep button so that person has no connection with that particular body that is for the time being this whole thing is an analysis about you yourself it's a vedanta all this is extremely subjective subjective not in a bad way in Vedanta the objective approach is a is a bad word subjective truth through the objective actual approach in Vedanta is is akin to falsity object is false it's something superimpose on the subject you say why would that be a good thing don't you see all your life you have being subjective and subjective alone even in all your efforts to be objective in science who is trying to be objective to subject you can never stand one millimeter away from the subject because you are eternally the subject and they learn to starts with the subject to make progress in science you need to be objective to be failure in judiciary in law and judging case if you need to be objective in certain respects but the fact is our life is entirely a life of the subject so this experience is from the point of view subject when you ask sleepwalking it's an objective thing somebody other we will see the person says sleep on and what are they seen sleepwalking a body they don't experience the subject inside the body what is the subject we may be you see has no connection with the path so from the main on this point of view it's not an interesting data because it's not a data at all how many of you have experienced sleepwalking due to many of us we have experienced sleepwalking I didn't say no you're not telling the truth if you experience if then you're walking not sleep are you dreaming so you even have bits in the dream what says yeah exactly so there's some seepage from the physical body into your awareness in the dream but your awareness was of a dreamworld if you experienced sleepwalking it's a contradiction in terms from Vedic perspective if you are asleep in the deep unit by definition you are not aware of the physical body what's that inputs from activate of a Honda and booth is a monster so it's a very good to stick approach by the way elements exist other other quick which are like very much he says that if religion is the opium of the masses then I must say that the Hindus have the insight to all right so this is the teaching given by the teacher to the student and he's supposed to be enlightened by this that by the method of presence and absence and not the physical body and not the subtle body and not the causal body and in that case what am i clearly the experiencer of the physical suffering and causal bodies if I am the experiencer and not the physical subtler causal bodies in that case I must be consciousness you yes [Music] yes when you use it no Phoenicians the use is very precise they're very clear about it why am I not this pen you say what a ridiculous idea Swami the pen is an object you aren't the person who is knowing or holding the pen you are not the pen because it's an object because I know it if you know it it must be an object it's an object in your awareness if it's an object in your awareness you cannot be the object you are the subject you're denying that that you are the object right now look at apply to the body of there now apply to the body the same principle is the body and object or not is the body an object or not the body is an object if the pain is an object I am NOT the pen the body is an object how can I beat the body then maintain it not this then you go to the subtle body not this and because a button not this and therefore what are you what are it yes because you are aware of all of this yes and that consciousness has no objective element if you eliminate every objective element from your consciousness like it eliminated means in your understanding you cannot physically eliminate ready nearly can be interpreted in this sense one is every object I am NOT that I am the witness or and the consciousness of that so object I am NOT first lady when you eliminate all objects you know what you'll end up with of blankness a blindness so I don't exist no maybe not that awesome first lady means I am NOT any object in the universe including body including life including mind into including in intellect including causal body none of these objects I am then that leaves nothing so I am not existing native not that either you are the witness of all these objects you're the witness of the absence of all of these objects that unchanging witness consciousness you are Shankar Acharya gives a very high range with this chakra area gives a very nice story in his commentary on the idea yo Phoenicians in the store the story goes like this a man was scolded by his teacher rebuked by the teacher and the teacher said you're not human just not human cannot you and the mindless she felt so bad and the student and you're sitting there hoping another person comes along and says why are you sad my teacher said I'm not human I am NOT human then this person said okay I'll help you don't feel bad what is not human at a rock yeah the rock is not human so I'm your rock no I'm not what is not human that plant the tree you know are you a tree no I'm not and he goes on like this eliminating all not humans the tree the deer and the birds and so on the snakes and he eliminates all not humans and the man agrees readily yeah I'm not any of these not humans so none of the not humans are you are not not human okay then the man venture carousel he asks if after all of this that man asks yeah I am NOT not human then we're alive if he asks after that nobody can help him he is supposed to get it if I am NOT not human I must be human if I am NOT any object I must be the consciousness aware of all of these objects if you teach it directly points out your pure consciousness what will happen is we'll start looking for an object called pure consciousness and they'll find it your pure existence will start looking for a thing called pure existence then we have this objectifying tendencies yes the back door into the vine yeah the last question yes yes they are objectified because this crucial idea it's very difficult for people to grasp the del can be something other than objects and the whole scientific enterprise has been enormously by its very nature by its very code and ethics has been objective so we want to find a thing called consciousness adjoint of a Rhonda says you never never will what will happen is my feeling is as this seriously investigate they will end up with you know what we saw today in the morning what is called tan Matra the subtle elements something like that will be found now if you have to cancer repercussions if you have if you actually find something like that that's an enormous step forward for both science and religion because once you point matter that's something that survives death what does the physical body gross body the cross matter that falls apart of death but the subtle body lives on so the whole idea was in an immortal soul which lives after the death of the physical body will have a scientific basis there if you actually find such a thing one but the second unintended consequence could be scientists will claim we have found consciousness no you have not you have found a very subtle kind of object body is a physical object brain is a physical object but all of that is a subtle kind of object still an object that's not consciousness your consciousness can never be objectified but the circle is important there's a question interesting there those people ask this question after you become enlightened with the subtle body go early after you realize there is no forest in the lake will the some of the trees disappear you're looking at the lake and you see the forest there but you realize there's no forest if it just looks like that once you realize that with the forest disappear now you know there is no forest if you take a dive in there you will not get interested in trees in there it's just water in the same way what we think right now here is a body in this is a mind and an intellect and beyond that some blankness called deep sleeping what whatever this is what I think that's what is really the enlightened person knows the only reality is existence consciousness list in which appears like the forest in the lake a body and a mind and a physical body subtle body causal body and after enlightenment what will happen it'll all go working just the way it is working will the body clean hungry sure well the mine think sure you would not break a mindless after enlightenment but you will never regard these things are real anymore what is real all those trees in the forest on the lake they are just water there actually is no trees there similarly this body is nothing other than such it under mind is nothing other than such as an under intellect is nothing that we've been such a down on top all the things that appear to you in consciousness are nothing other than using consciousness in the first step I repeat this again and again in my cup two steps in the first step we step back from body mind gross body subtle particles of body universe and we discover that all cells as pure consciousness but this is just sunk yet you've separated two things now when you say this thing does not exist which is just the radiance of this consciousness it's like asking you to separate the forest in the lake from the lake water that you separate in your mind but you also realize the forest in the lake is nothing apart from the lake it is just the lake itself it appears like that in the same way as conscious in consciousness appears as this word at the body as the subtle body as the causal body all of which is consciousness absolutely we began to put it in in Rajputana in the desert he saw a mirage waternoose yes thirsty he went there to get water he saw it said me ROG there's no water there it looks like water all right now he knows there is no water he stops walking and he looks back what does he see water but now he knows there is no water there it knows it's mr. monatti in the same way this entire world which seems so attractive and so terrifying feel anxiety and fear and attraction all of that because we give it reality what do you mean reality reality apart from us there is a real terrifying thing out there apart from me there is a really tempting thing out there apart from me so I run after that and I run away from that and that's my life the illusion Vistal preceding verses because that's Maya I will talk a little more about this just hold on to this we are going to have some real food knock knock illusion and then beauty comes won't come back and turn it into usually so hold this stuff well this time I'll talk about it Oh Shaun - Shaun - Shaun [Music] so this was you know a monastic teaching shravana mañana needed asana teaching reflection meditation so the teacher has taught the student this was teaching the Shahana then they will be the student will have questions doubts though this is wrong that's wrong it and so that's settled and then they will be teaching on meditation so that remains you